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Dama Jue, a funnel strategist and Thrivecart expert is back to break down the reality behind evergreen funnels and shares an easier way to boost sales without the constant upkeep.
Dama brings a fresh perspective on making your business work smarter, with the exact strategy she uses to simplify the sales process.
Watch the previous episode ‘How She Built a 6-Figure Business Teaching Funnels Featuring Dama Jue’
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Links mentioned in this episode:
Kwadwo [QUĀY.jo] Sampany-Kessie’s Links:
- Get 1:1 Meta Ads Coaching from Kwadwo!
- Say hi to Kwadwo on Instagram
- Subscribe to The Art of Online Business’s YouTube Channel
Dama’s Links:
Speaker 1:
Welcome back to another episode of the Art of Online Business. And guess who’s back? It is my wife, jamie. She’s here with me and we’re both interviewing again Dama Ju, and if you can’t see her right now, well, you gotta click off of your audio platform and go over to YouTube because she’s really a great interview. She is a funnels specialist.
Speaker 1:
This is her second episode on the podcast. The first one was all about her business journey, some pivots that she made along the way to having a business where she makes now from her funnels six figures just from affiliate revenue and that’s like a third or less of her annual income. Like impressive business. But she’s about to talk to you. Well, let’s hop into the episode and you’ll see exactly what she’s gonna talk to you about. Is there a simpler, lazy way than evergreen to make more sales and increase like the average amount that somebody spins with you? If you’re ever with her hoping, or if you thought evergreen funnels were the Holy grail, well, dama’s here to tell you they aren’t and there’s a better way. So let’s get into this, dama. Like what is a way to make more money than evergreen funnels, but in a more lazier, easier to do sort of setup? Like, do tell please. Okay.
Speaker 2:
So I’m not saying that evergreen funnels are bad. I have evergreen funnels. I have a funnel that I put together in March of 2022. And to this day, it’s still making me money. To this day it’s made me over six figures without ads because, hilariously, when I ran ads to it, what really the ads people the ad, the yes, the cold, the ice cold audience did not love it. The hot, the warmed up audience, or people who had seen me speak, people had met me some other way were like yeah, yeah, I want to learn from this person. The ads people were like I don’t like her face, I don’t want to buy it and so it was.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, I have run ads a couple of times to this funnel, and she’s beautiful, all by herself, like without running ads. I let her be.
Speaker 1:
Hold on, you have got to try it this year because it might work. There’s been a setting that I have been loving running for my clients who have SLO funnels and it’s like it’s now just my go-to, my go-to one, including like evergreen stuff. So like when we finish, I will tell you let’s talk about it.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, it’s not an SLO funnel, it’s a webinar funnel.
Speaker 1:
It’s a webinar Same In my mind, same Turn on ads, go to the webinar, make money. You owe it to yourself to open your ad manager and click a few buttons. I can tell you and then go for it. I love it.
Speaker 2:
Let’s do it.
Speaker 2:
All right, so anyway so yes, I’m not anti-Evergreen funnel and I should say my background is I was a funnel builder. I built funnels for clients, did that for a long time. So I love funnels. I don’t have any problem against them. I have them for myself. But here’s the thing I have like a million different offers as of this moment. If we were to like just count SKUs the way e-comm does, I have 17 or 20, something like that. Different five card templates I have currently five or six, with many, many more on the way. Airtable offers I have courses, I have trainings, I have tech tutorials, I have live workshops. I have a lot of offers. I have these fun punchy little $9 offers. So I have a lot of different offers, like probably 50. At this point.
Speaker 2:
That’s overwhelming to everyone and I’m not going to create a funnel for all of them, because the unpleasant truth is, and why everybody doesn’t have a funnel, is that creating an evergreen funnel in the way that most people think and I’ll clarify what I mean by that in the way that most people think is a ton of time work. You need a lot of strategic prowess, you need to write a lot ofess, you need to write a lot of copy. You need to write conversion copy, which is hard to write. You need to understand the tech, you need to design the pages, the assets, the elements. Evergreen funnels are a lot of work and that’s coming from someone who is living doing it and that’s why all the time people are like oh you teach funnels, I need a funnel.
Speaker 2:
And my follow-up question and I don’t mean this maliciously, but I truly mean this in the best sense of the way why, what are you selling, right? And I, oh, and I literally just asked Guijo this, like five seconds ago Off camera. I literally just roasted Guijo because I was like why, what are you selling? And my, if you caught my origin story episode, it’s all about how am I going to pay red? How am I going to buy the expensive dog food that my dog requires? How am I going to put gas in my tank? And will a funnel do that? Will building a funnel for every one of my offers do that? Will only having one offer and an evergreen funnel for my offer, do that? Maybe it’s different for everybody, but you said you have low, all low ticket offers.
Speaker 3:
Is that right?
Speaker 2:
Yeah, I have. So some of my offers on the lowest end are $9. Um, I have a couple that are one 77, one 97, four 97. I have a group program. That’s four figures, and then people can work with me one-on-one per quarter. No course content, just working with me one-on-one, and that’s also four figures. So, yeah, there’s the majority of it. Though the majority of how I pay my rent, how do I buy the expensive dog food, is low ticket offers. So does that mean that low ticket offers is for everybody? No, that’s a whole other episode. I’m going to have to have you back to rail on that.
Speaker 2:
But whenever people tell me I need a funnel, my number one question is not so much do you, but why? What do you want to sell more of? How are you going to pay your rent? Right, if you’re a service provider and you want to get into digital products, that’s cool. What are you going to sell?
Speaker 2:
Because a lot of people get stuck in. I need a funnel, they will. I need to create a course, or I need to create a digital product, and they’ll do it. They’ll create that course and then it sits on the digital shelf. They either don’t wanna sell, they don’t wanna write and write salesy words, they don’t wanna write conversion copy, so they don’t do the lead gen or actually the active selling that requires that selling that bought, that people buying it requires, right, they don’t want to do that.
Speaker 2:
So it’s like, well, I need a funnel. A funnel will do it for me. Yes, but you still have to write the salesy words and you need to set up the tech and you need duplicate pages and a countdown timer. So when I say evergreen funnel, most people think of that. It. It’s an opt-in, so maybe a challenge or a webinar could be a freebie, something like that. And then there’s seven to 12 emails that build to a salesy crescendo. There’s countdown timers and then this thing happens when this expires and this page, they say click that. And then this triggers that like it can get and it all disappears.
Speaker 2:
And then it can get quite complicated. So, from a technical perspective, it’s a lot of work to set up. It’s a lot of assets that you need to create, or you need to pay a funnel builder five figures to do for you. And then a person hears about you oh, I heard of the art of online business podcast. I’m going to go and I’m going to. They’re talking about this thing. You know, during the opening of the show or the closing of the show, I’m going to sign up for it.
Speaker 2:
They go through the funnel and at that time you’re talking about, let’s say oh, you’ve tried to run your own ads and you have this 90 minute ads breakthrough session. I’ll set up your ads campaign for you, or I’ll diagnose, you know, I’ll help you streamline your current setup. 90 minute can blow your mind with it, but they don’t have ads yet, they don’t have an offer yet. And the thing with evergreen funnels is, if they go through it once most everybody doesn’t set it up so that there’s a way for them to go through it once most everybody doesn’t set it up so that there’s a way for them to go through it again they’re marked as a lead who entered the funnel, exited the funnel closed, lost, right. You lost that sale because they didn’t buy and they went through the funnel and because of the magic of countdown timers, they’re never going to go through it again. They’ll click and it’ll redirect, right. So it feels like a missed opportunity to me. I’m not saying I don’t have them I still have funnels but I think that big of a effort, that many assets. I mean for a given, any given funnel you might need 12 to 20 different assets promo graphics, swipe copy emails, follow-up emails, nurture emails oh, you didn’t click, or I saw that you clicked and this and that countdown time. You need a lot of assets, you need to several pages and a lot of work there. It can be too much to do and people get stuck in the I need a funnel and then the.
Speaker 2:
In the meantime, while they’re saying I need a funnel, they’re still not telling their audience about the offer and telling them to buy it. Well, I promoted it once in February. Nobody bought it, so I’m never going to talk about it again. We’ve all done that, right, but like that’s the thing is that we need to be reminded about offers and the person who first signed up from your list by listening to a podcast episode in February, didn’t have a digital product. Well, it’s October. Now they have a digital product. They sold 17 spots in their new course Like that’s amazing. They sold 17 spots in their new course Like that’s amazing. Now, what? Right now, maybe they might want to go through ads. So our where we’re at, in our point of time as a lead changes.
Speaker 2:
But with funnels it can be kind of rigid. Well, that person went through the funnel already. They opt in again and it’s like oh, you’ve already received that. Or it just sends them to the full price page. They can never get the discount or whatever. So or they forgot about it and they click in someone else’s funnel and then they buy that person’s offer, right? So my strategy with this is, yes, I still build funnels, but I tend to give people lots and lots and lots of opportunities to buy. I I was chatting with Pedro before the episode and he likes to send emails that are about like here’s the content, here’s the latest podcast episode. I send salesy emails because I love to like I can’t write a content email and like a value email and it not have a CTA at the end. I can’t stop myself. I write blog posts and I’m like I really need to just hire a content writer, because all I’m doing is writing a sales page here.
Speaker 2:
So, I like to write that that’s my funnel background. Most people that doesn’t come naturally to them. So what I like to do, or what I prefer to do instead of having this multi-step complicated I need a chart to map it out kind of funnel is let’s just give people lots of opportunities to buy.
Speaker 1:
Okay.
Speaker 2:
Every opportunity to buy in many different formats. So you might join my list, get present. You know, you might check out my. You know I have this free BTS training we’ll talk about in a bit and somebody might go through that and decide they don’t need anything, but later I’ll present them with it again. Later I’ll have mentioned something in that that I’ll present them with again. I just keep subtly reminding folks of like hey, when you’re ready, I still have this. Do you have this? You don’t have this. You should get this. This is what people are using it for. This is how it’s benefiting people. So there is this common trope.
Speaker 2:
I find that, like people don’t want to sound salesy and they don’t want to sound repetitive no one knows what you emailed four months ago. Like I don’t even know what I emailed four months ago, I don’t even remember, and so I don’t. I expect that people won’t, and if I’m a little repetitive, that’s okay, they can unsubscribe, they’re welcome to. If I’m a little repetitive, maybe they’re finally hearing it on a day where they’re like yeah, okay, maybe I do want that ad intensive, because I tried to run, I bought a $37 thing and I got stuck and I had nowhere to go. So now I’m ready for a 90 minute intensive. Now I’m like you know what? I see the profit, I see the math. Now shove me through the funnel one more time, but it’s like the funnel is nowhere to be found. So if you have a way that is going to help people pay their rent, help you pay your rent and help people accomplish their goals probably to pay their rent and to buy food and to put gas in their car Right? So that’s why we have businesses they’re not charities. So you need to pay your rent, they need to pay the rent. So you have a solution that will help them and also it helps you pay rent. So be talking about it, stay talking about it.
Speaker 2:
And I think that once people set up an evergreen funnel, we tend to set it and forget it, because that’s what the gurus have taught us Set up your funnel and then, like, forget it it. You know it’s like, but as a lead in that, does it feel good? Have you ever, like, been on Pinterest and signed up for something and it’s like the email never got delivered because the person went out of business, like six years ago? Like I don’t want to be getting emails from the script or whatever you know like this is creepy or it’s just, it’s like no longer relevant, right, so it doesn’t feel good. As a lead. I like to show up frequently in my business because then people know like hey, I keep my finger on the pulse of things and I’m constantly experimenting and testing and I think that that gives them confidence in my offers because I stay talking about it.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, I recorded, I recorded freebie to flash sale in 2021. Is it still good? Yeah, I recorded, I recorded freebie to flash sale in 2021. Is it still good? Yes, I stay talking about it. I sent an email about it on Saturday. Is it still relevant? Is it still a banging offer? Yeah, and I’ll tell you what. I sent an email about it on Saturday. That was a full price. I didn’t even discount it. It wasn’t even like here’s a cute coupon code. I was just like here it is.
Speaker 2:
People bought it. You know like a couple of people bought it, did 80% of my list, no, but a good chunk of my list has heard about it. A good chunk of my list already has it. So I’m kind of like yeah, I’m just going to remind them of how good that is and let them know it’s still there and it’s still relevant, and I’m still showing up and doing business and I still stand behind this method.
Speaker 2:
So I think, yes, funnels are great, but it always starts with how are you going to like we’re not in business for fun, unless you’re like independently wealthy, you got to pay your rent, you got to buy carrot sticks and whatever else you got to buy for groceries. So got to go get a pound of ground beef and some spaghetti or whatever, right. So like, how are you going to do that? What in your business is going to pay that bill? And then think about how can I sell more of that? So the alternative and this is what feels good for me and that I’ve taught thousands of students they really love is, instead of I created a new thing, I sold it. I talked about it till my face turned blue and now I never wanna talk about it again. Okay, you could create a funnel, but what we end up doing is putting create an evergreen funnel on our to-do list, then it never gets done right. Or putting create an evergreen funnel on our to-do list, then it never gets done Right. Or we’ll even join a group program and like this is it? I’m going to create a funnel and then we lose steam because life catches up or we get sick or something happens. I go on vacation and I kind of lose momentum, whatever. So it it can get left on the to-do list for forever. But I’ll tell you what I can do right away, the minute I closed the cart on a sale. So, for example, I did a training, I don’t know 2021. It’s still good. It’s still banging. All the things that I taught in it. It’s actually like how I got started with building affiliate income as a service provider. I recorded that in 2022, all the strategies that I taught I’m still doing because guess freaking what they’re still working.
Speaker 2:
So that offer, I could sit down and like write a bunch of emails about it, or I can just throw it on a new product as the order bump. It takes me so, so just, I don’t know how, like I don’t want to be too jargony, but basically an order bump is when you’re going to buy a thing. Don’t want to be too jargony, but basically an order bump is when you’re going to buy a thing. Hey, quajo has this $17 Facebook ads checklist. Okay, cool, I went to buy it and before I entered my name and my email and my credit card info, and before I clicked purchase, there’s a little checkbox that says hey, do you want to access you know Quajo’s vault of 72 different successful ad creatives with you know an R, a ROAS of 3.2 or higher? Yeah, I want to look at that right, I don’t even know, hold on a second, let me write that down.
Speaker 1:
Go ahead and write it down, let’s get the product idea here.
Speaker 2:
Continue, that’s the thing. You write one sentence of conversion copy. What is the next problem they’re going to have? Well, they’re going to know, okay. So now I’m giving them a checklist of like the technical stuff. They still need to write their ad copy or their headline, or design their graphic in Canva, or pick a photo from their brand, shoot whatever. What’s their next problem? Can I give them a low ticket option that I can create in an afternoon that I can then use again and again? And guess what? Six months later, kwejo comes out with a scale your membership ads bootcamp and he can throw that same $17 order bump on that.
Speaker 2:
I use Thrivecart as my funnel software. I can copy it over and in about 30 seconds, reuse that same order bump and just go and now it’s collecting 17 bucks on every transaction. I can throw that on a free opt-in sign up for my free challenge. While you’re here, Do you want to access the 3.2 row asphalt Boop? 17 bucks, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding. And I could have created a funnel and made it $57 and wrote a sales page and wrote emails and like blah, blah, blah. Yeah, I could do that, but I don’t want to. I’m busy, I’m lazy. I have better things to do. I could be binging, grazing on me right Like it’s. I have something else I’d rather be doing than that. So what I can do in the moment that I close the cart, like well, that sale ended, that was cool, that went well. Let me just take 20 minutes and identify one or two of my products that I can throw this as an order bump on. You create it once. You write one sentence of copy. You throw your little mock up on there 20 minutes later done and then you can just copy that to two or three other products, use it down the line. So this night, you know, 60 minute, how I got started with affiliate income training that I did in 2022. Night, you know, 60 minute, how I got started with affiliate income training that I did in 2022.
Speaker 2:
Somebody bought it today as an order bump for $39. Love it, love to see it. Do I have a funnel for it? Absolutely not. Like you know, with emails and pop-ups and opt-ins. Nope, absolutely not. But did I make $39 today that I wouldn’t have made otherwise? Yeah, so that’s one option is throw it on an order bump’s for lower ticket stuff if you’re comfortable selling it, basically like tripwire prices anywhere between 7 and 47, right, if you’re comfortable selling it for that little, throw it on an order bump. If it’s something that you normally sell for 497.
Speaker 2:
You could wait until you get an evergreen funnel built up and an opt-in and then nurture emails and then this and set up the sequence and do to do and create the tags and clone the pages and la la, la, do all the dance or put that on your to-do list, but also, in the meantime, spend the next 45 minutes turning it into an upsell or an oto. Somebody bought quajo’s 37, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Okay, great. As soon as they click purchase, it takes them to the upsell or the one-time offer, oto, whatever you want to call it, whatever. It’s a page that’s displayed after they’ve hit purchase and it’s like wait before you go.
Speaker 2:
Do you want to add a 90-minute call with Quajo? It’s normally $9.97, but you can grab it for $3.97. Hey, you didn’t have that $400 a minute ago. If they see that, that’s a good deal and it’s valuable to them and it’s useful to them in that moment, that’s $400 closer to paying your rent. That’s $400 more expensive, kibble or whatever you spend your money on. You know, like more money and more gas in the tank or whatever. So you could go through all the work of creating an evergreen funnel and I do still do it. But in the meantime, if it’s 47 bucks or less, throw it as an order bump on something else. If it’s, you know, a hundred bucks, 150, 200 bucks, 300 bucks, maybe 400. If it’s under 500, throw it as an upsell on something. So what I’m hearing?
Speaker 3:
is basically you. You do one or maybe a couple evergreen funnels, but you’ve basically just become the master of upselling, cross-selling, order bumping, trip wiring, all of these extra things that you want to call it downselling.
Speaker 2:
I actually wrote out a little list of some other ways lazy, strategic ways that I make sales without an evergreen funnel and by, again, by evergreen funnel I mean an opt-in, and seven to 10 nurture emails count on time. Blah, blah, blah. Another idea is I talked earlier about writing one sentence of conversion copy. Right, so you’re already buying this $17 Facebook ad checklist thing Cool. You already wrote a sales page for it. That’s great. All I’m asking you now is to write one additional sentence about your ad creative vault or whatever. I’m only asking you to write one sentence of conversion copy. Well, now that you wrote it, it’d be kind of a shame to just leave it on the order bump. What if the next time you’re talking about a client win, you’re doing like a testimonial or you know a case study for a client who’s running webinar ads with you and you’re promoting your agency work? Ok, cool. Also, you know you might mention we tweaked. Here’s what we did. We tweaked their creative parentheses, stuck on your creative snag my library of 72 different ad creatives from real live working campaigns that have a 3.2 or higher ROAS.
Speaker 2:
One sentence, it’s hooky as all get out. It’s like Ooh, I want that. And all you do is link to the checkout page of the other thing, not even as an order month, like here’s a little checkout page, right? Take that one sentence that you wrote. Mention it in emails. I do this all the time. I mention it in my footers of my emails. I mention it in my course footers. Now, this is kind of wild. I don’t see anyone else doing this. You literally bought a thing for me. You’re in here learning and then you scroll to the bottom and I’m like here’s the tech I’m using affiliate link. Here’s this I’m using, here’s that. Here’s the best library of legal templates and it’s only 50 bucks. People click that and buy that based on that link. That is the footer of every single one of my course lessons regularly. So I list them even in my course footer. I use that sentence as Easter eggs inside of other courses. I just see Kwejo smiling so hard right now.
Speaker 1:
So I’m like just tell me I want my notepad open right here.
Speaker 3:
This is all the backend marketing right, Right, Like the front doors.
Speaker 3:
people are coming in through the funnel and you’re acquiring that new customer, but once they’re already there, all of these things that you’re saying are just like. It’s so true. It’s like, hey, you already have this super valuable thing and now you need this other super valuable thing to be able to implement this or whatever, and it all just ties together and connects, kind of like you mentioned in the previous episode. But it’s something that I just and this is all tying in I’m really excited because another course that I actually just took is talking exactly about all of this and how it works.
Speaker 3:
But it’s the the buyer has like a buying frenzy, right Like when they first come in and they want to. It’s like they want to give you their money, and so when you’re offering these you know order bumps and upsells and downsells and cross-sells and all the things you’re kind of just like continuing to offer them. So they, they literally buy themselves out of their buying frenzy, right. It’s like when they’re hot, when they’re coming in, they want to give you their money and you’re just offering them the things that they need, and some of it is mindset, right Of like can I continue to offer all of these different things, but at the same time, we keep saying this selling is serving, and if it’s something that they actually need and it’s helpful to them, then why not right?
Speaker 3:
and it can double or triple your, your, your profit, from that initial item, right? So very, very good, love it.
Speaker 2:
In the previous episode we talked about about two-thirds of my income comes from digital products. Of that, every launch I do, between 20 and 30 percent of the revenue is from bumps and upsells even more.
Speaker 2:
So I’m basically, oh, I 1.2x my own launch results by just throwinga bump and an upsell on there. And guess what? I just reused that thing that I already had as a bump somewhere else because maybe somebody didn’t buy it. And now they saw, saw it, and they were like, oh, pay your pals, this is all about creating an affiliate program in Thrive Car. Oh, no, no, no, I don’t even have products. I don’t want that Decline the next time they see it and it’s like well, I do have digital products now Do I want an affiliate program? Ooh, but it’s only to buy it, right, and I don’t see that.
Speaker 2:
I see it as a service, because I’m not doing you any favors by not telling you what I have and that can help you, especially when, in the online space, so many things can can kind of impact how we learn, whether the person has a private podcast, whether they offer subtitles, their speaking cadence, their accent, their voice, is it scratchy, is it nasally, whatever there’s so many little things that are vying for our attention. That makes it really easy to not finish a course. So if you find someone who you like, their teaching style, well then, what else you got? I literally have people tell me that, like, do you have anything on this, do you have anything on that? Cause they just they like my style and they want to keep learning from me.
Speaker 2:
So, to me it would be a disservice to not tell them like you have this, can I have you tried that? You know like, have you seen this? You know like, I don’t think you have this. I think you need this Right, and I do think that there is a fine line with hitting people over the head with too many offers. So there is, there is a little fine line there.
Speaker 2:
I don’t do, cause you’ll find that some funnel strategists will say have the main offer, let it be $37. And then the upsell should be one 97. And then if they decline that, hit them with another upsell for 97. And if they accept that, then hit them with another upsell. So there’s like they get presented with a lot of choices. It can be exhausting to have that many options. So I don’t frequently have anything more than main offer, order, bump and upsell. I don’t really do a lot of downsells.
Speaker 2:
I’ll catch y’all later, like, if you didn’t want it, that’s okay, I’ll catch you later. If you didn’t want to pay your pals now you’re not ready to create an affiliate program, we’ll talk in six months, we’ll talk in a year. And there are a lot of my customers are repeat buyers, so it’s like okay, well, whatever. In the back of my mind I know that I was offered this. It’s fine, I’ll. I’ll see it another time and they’ll buy something else and then we’ll see it, or they’ll see it on a black Friday sale or whatever. I tend to not want to hit them with too many options during a funnel because it can feel like I can’t get out of this. So my husband not a funnel guy whatsoever, but bought something health related and totally got sucked into like a bro-y funnel and he could not believe how many times. It was a really scuzzy funnel where it was like you couldn’t say yes or no to the upsell until the autoplay video had played.
Speaker 2:
And you couldn’t fast forward it, you couldn’t skip past it. You were just forced to watch this guy talk about his like supplements or whatever. And there was. There was the button. They had used css to hide the code until and the video had elapsed, until you’d watched at least two minutes of the video. And then a button and like very small print, like no, I don’t want to 10x my results or no, I don’t want to be in my best shape ever, or some bullying crap like that.
Speaker 2:
So, I don’t believe in that and that is enough to put me off of buying a person or hiring a person, buying their offers or hiring them, kind of. For the rest of my life I’ll be like Nope, trash X, never buying, nope, you know, I am really careful to treat my customers the way I want to be treated. So I don’t do a lot of upsells and downsells and this and that. I just mentioned the thing. It’s like do you want it now? You don’t want it now, that’s cool, catch you later. All good, you know, like not a problem, we’ll see you in six months for black Friday, not a problem, see you in six months for my business anniversary sale. So I do two sales a year. They can catch me then or they can. I kind of love to surprise people with what’s going to be on the upsell on the bump.
Speaker 2:
I change them out frequently. I’m always testing different things because it takes me like three minutes. So yeah, I’ll just swap it out. And once you you know that’s the hard part I think it’s getting the facility with the tech. But once you have that, you, so that’s the hard part, I think it’s getting the facility with the tech. But once you have that. You’re like oh okay, I’m good, I’ll just swap this out. You know what? I’m not feeling this anymore. I’m going to swap this out. Or like hmm, conversion rate dropped to 18%.
Speaker 1:
Let me try something else, let me do something else.
Speaker 2:
Let’s try something else, yeah, and my customers think it’s because people know that I don’t do modest discounts on those upsells. They’re always 50 to 70% off and they always want to know what’s on there and I’m like you’ll just have to buy and see. You know, and don’t want to. Don’t quote me because it might have been payer pals today, but tomorrow I felt a gentle breeze and I changed it to something else. You know, I like to keep, I like to keep experimenting. So that’s kind of a big pillar in my business. It’s like, yeah, I’m going to give people plenty of options, but without hitting them over the head, and I feel like sometimes when you do a seven or 12 email sequence, anyone would get kind of exhausted with that. Here’s a regular email and I’ve got a one sentence about pay your pals, like when you’re ready to create your affiliate program. Here’s the hundred. Ok, you know like you click it or you don’t. Fine, whatever, there’ll be something else in the email for you.
Speaker 1:
You should be like. The upsell is a preview of the upcoming upsells.
Speaker 2:
I’m going to release the thing they hate the most is when I have something that is only available as an upsell. They hate that. They’re like no, I don’t want to buy the whole thing, I just want this, you know. So I don’t do that that often because I’ve actually had like customers say well, why can’t I buy this? I have this training called low, what is it?
Speaker 2:
Low impact, high, no, low energy, high impact affiliate programs. It’s basically all my strategies of how I motivate my own affiliates to promote my stuff, and when I’m doing a promotion, I love to see my affiliate army like just out there rocking. I love to see it, love to pay them. And so I’ve had people say well, how can I learn that? And I’m like oh, it’s called Lehiap, it’s called low and back. You know, hi, whatever is this training and it’s available as the upsell on, pay your pals and like can I buy it individually? No, ma’am, because I’m too lazy to create a checkout for it and I also think that you should have the main product, like it was strategic as the order that I put it in, so no thought to it all right.
Speaker 1:
so I’m gonna do a hard segue and say this other thing that you’ve put thought into that the listener most likely will want to get is behind the scenes, funnel map and more of your oldest running successful funnel. Yeah, do you want to talk a little about that, because I’m putting it in the show notes below? Yeah, so.
Speaker 2:
I do get this question Because I was a funnel builder and I have my hands in a lot of tech and a lot of people’s tech. What works best, kartra versus Kajabi, samcart versus ThriveCart? I get tech questions a lot. Convertkit versus ActiveCampaign versus Drip I hear this a lot. Is Flowdesk good? Yet no, stop using Flowdesk. Anyway, sorry shots fired. Do you use Flowdesk?
Speaker 1:
No, I don’t use Flowdesk. I can ask before I talk trash. It’s fine. No more flow desk clients. I don’t like flow desk. Keep going, thank you.
Speaker 2:
So I do get asked a lot of questions and I have a tech blog. So people ask me a lot of questions about my tech and then when I talk about especially when I talk about bumps and upsells like they need to see it or they want to understand conceptually, like, how does that work? Work, I don’t even understand how to do that. You add a checkbox. How does that enroll people in the thing? How does it all work? So I recorded this training. It’s called my Thrivecart Funnel Flow. Essentially, I use Thrivecart as my funnel software. I run my whole business through it. I take payment through it. Sales pages, checkouts, courses, my affiliate program, all that jazz. It’s all in there.
Speaker 2:
I bought it in 2020 or 2019. I paid them once and it’s been serving my business for many years and many hundreds of thousands of dollars in revenue. It’s done really well for me. So people always want to know how are you using it. So that’s what this is. It’s just a mini training. It’s a BTS or a behind the scenes training of how do I use it. What does a funnel in actuality look like? How does it work? How do people get on your email list? How do they get enrolled in the course. What does that look like? So it basically takes you behind the scenes, and people are always intrigued to see how I have it set up, and so I’m happy to share that.
Speaker 1:
Yay, I’m about to get it. Thank you for sharing all of this good info. I, for one you already caught me smiling and taking notes in my notepad. I hope the listener was too, because this was some good stuff and we’re going to have to scrub back and re-listen to it. But, Damaju, thank you for recording. And if somebody goes and gets this behind the scenes of your longest running successful funnel, where’s one more place that they can find you?
Speaker 2:
I hang out and probably I’m on my most feral. My spiciest takes are on threads, so my handle is Damaju, you can find you. I hang out and probably I’m on my most feral. My spiciest takes are on threads, so my handle is DamaJu. You can find me on threads. I don’t do a lot on Instagram or Facebook. I am starting my YouTube journey. Just got a little encouragement from Kwejo, so I will be doing my YouTube journey and I’m going to be teaching live on YouTube and inviting folks to come and pick my brain. I don’t do that very often, but it’s happening. It’s going to be happening live and it’s going to be happening on YouTube, so find me at DhammaJu on YouTube.
Speaker 1:
Nice, your first YouTube episode. Which is worse, Flowdesk or MailChimp?
Speaker 2:
Oh, the Flowdesk hate. I mean, that’s actually a pretty rough question. I would have nothing nice to say. That’s pretty rough.
Speaker 1:
That would be a hard question to answer. We should have nothing nice to say.
Speaker 2:
That’s pretty rough, that would be a hard question to answer. We should put together a panel and just far from both of those platforms.
Speaker 1:
We’re gonna say goodbye now, but thanks for being here dava, all right, thanks for having me thank you thanks for listening listener, and we’ll see you in the next one. Before then, keep being blessed. Chat soon. Bye.
